Andrew Scrivani took all the tempting photos in Art of the Pie. This shot is for Apricot Raspberry Pie.
I fell for “Piechiatrist” Kate McDermott recently, even though I had known her casually for years. I had never thought about how she found her voice. Then, while reading the introduction to her gorgeous cookbook, Art of the Pie, I read that Joni Mitchell’s “Sisotowbell Lane” always put Kate in the right frame of mind to bake.
I hadn’t thought about that song for years. Suddenly I was back in high school, memorizing the lyrics, lying on my sister’s bed (where the record player lived). Back then, I thought Joni Mitchell’s words would explain my life to me.
Also back then, Kate McDermott lived an alternative lifestyle. Since then she’s become a travelling pie instructor, and wrote her first cookbook in her 60s. In Kate’s cookbook, she incorporates her life lessons, and found her voice.
And since its debut last October, Art of the Pie sells like hotcakes…I mean pies. Nominated for several national awards, the book’s initial print run of 30,000 was way too small and has been in reprint many times. While the book is beautifully designed and photographed, what struck me was Kate’s homey, grounding voice, guiding me not only on pie success but Important Life Lessons.
Here’s how Kate harnessed her life history and personal philosophy to create a cookbook that speaks directly from her heart:
Q. What I liked about the cookbook was your voice, that you were only trying to be you and not someone else, particularly someone younger.
A. It took me a while to figure out what people meant when they said “you have to find your voice.” As soon as I stopped thinking about that and wrote like I was just talking to you, it worked. I stopped thinking I had to sound a certain way. I just had to get out of the way. When I turned in my first draft, my wonderful editor said, “I can hear your voice.”
Q. You did not take the conventional route to a cookbook. How old were you when your first book came out?
A. I was 63. If someone told me, at the age I am now, that I would be a bestselling author, on a topic that is something I’ve done my entire life, I would have thought they were crazy.
Q. Before you taught pie making, you were also a teacher, but of music.
A. I was a professional accompanist playing piano and harpsichord, and a teacher. I was also a music coach. People would come if they were preparing for a recital.
Q. And you were living in a remote mountain cabin at one point, when you were married with a young child?
A. Yes. I lived in a 325-square foot cabin for nearly 5 years, with four people, near Port Angeles, WA, while we built a house. Then I moved to a treehouse, and I was there for a few years, just me and my son. The house was hung on 28 poles rammed into the earth. No part of the house ever touched the ground. I had a big garden, and I bartered and traded a lot.
Q. How do you think this history affected your voice and advice in the book?
A. What “living out” taught me was the important connection of family, and the beauty of the day to day, of small things. We had a small network of friends, and we were trying to scratch out a living creatively. Many of them are still my closest friends. That time taught me it doesn’t take a lot of glitzy stuff to be happy.
That philosophy comes through in the book, where readers can concentrate on just making a pie as a way of connecting with people. I want them to find beauty in the smallest things, like making a pie or baking bread.
When you wonder why “anyone should care” about a subject that’s already been covered, read this book. Kate made pie-making sound fresh and different.
Q. How did you know to add wisdom to the instructions, such as “Perfection isn’t the goal, finding beauty and peace through the process is the goal.” That went to the way you live your life.
A. I learned some of that teaching music to children. They were so concerned that they had played a wrong note. I’d say, “Don’t worry because there are lot more right ones to come.” We can get so easily stuck with this idea of perfection. It’s nice to have an ideal, but my pie is going to be the one that is right for me.
Q. Perfection is a big issue for a lot of food writers.
A. As a musician, I hear recordings that are perfect. And then I go to a concert, and I remember that there was a wrong note or someone was out of tune. Just as the pictures in a cookbook present this beautiful idea that may not be achievable for everyone.
Q. Perhaps this is why you tell people to be themselves, such as using Goodwill or yard sale bowls and cups to measure?
A. It’s whatever makes them authentic. What’s important to them.
Q. I love the “Rules of pie making and life” section. Why are important life lessons part of pie baking? Number 1, for example, is “Keep everything chilled, especially yourself.”
A. Stress can make you sick. I’ve had my share of stress. I need something on a daily basis that helps me to remember that most everything is transitory. And not to get too hung up on any one thing. Life will give us both peaks and valleys. We have to enjoy the peak completely, because it will not always be that way. When we’re in a valley, it’s not permanent.
Kate’s joy of making a pie resulted in cooking classes, a cookbook, and a captivated new audience.
Q. What did you learn about writing a cookbook that will help you with the next one?
A. My agent said to me, while I was waiting for the advance, to just “write write write, no matter what.” The thing is to keep moving along and keep working. I feel a lot more relaxed now. I can write another book. The first time around was, “Can I really do that?”
Q. Did you expect your book to sell like crazy?
A. I feel like Cinderella. I came late to the ball! In presales, my book broke the Amazon top 100 list.
And because of my mention of the website leaf lard by Fanny and Flo in my book, I got the best reward ever. Fanny emailed to say that she has now hired a single mother who lifted herself off public assistance, and a father who can provide for his family.
Q. How fantastic to help others through your book. Any last words?
A. I’m very grateful. And I’m not done yet.
Wonderful interview. I enjoyed reading it. Also, cheers to Kate on the success of her book!
Thank you so much Domenica! The book was a labor of love. I think Dianne captured that perfectly.
Thank you Domenica. She’s not the usual cookbook author, that’s for sure. I’m thrilled that her book is doing so well.
Terrific interview Dianne. and thanks Kate. I loved talking with you at IACP this year, that crazy late night a bunch of us ended up in the hotel sports bar for a late salad. It’s got to be incredibly satisfying to have your book do so well, and it’s well deserved! Congratulations! I hear you on the voice thing. Dianne told me to write like I was writing to her personally, and that helped me a lot. And I love your pie wisdom tips. Your tagline says it all. Makes it so personal. Hurray for us who are 60 and up and publishing our first books!
Thanks Sally. Yeah, we old ladies keep surprising people, eh? And as she says, we’re not done yet!
What a fun night that was, Sally! I think we make things harder than they need to be sometimes. When I stopped trying to write, and just wrote, it really was easier. Good luck on your project!
This is so inspiring, thank you Dianne! Congratulations to Kate, what a great success story!
Thank you so much Sharon!
Thanks, Dianne — and Kate. Your lessons aren’t only about pie, they’re about life, about finding the deliciousness.
…both sweet and savory! 😉
Dianne- Thanks for asking the questions I would ask! You always seem to understand what your readers want to know.
Kate-Your book is inspiring, an inspiration, and my spouse is so happy you wrote it-it encourages more pie.
Eagerly waiting for the next lesson in life.
Polly
Thanks Polly for your very kind words. I’m glad that both you and your spouse like it. Here’s to more pie and life!
Diane,
Thanks for that interview…now I have to have this cookbook! And, I’m inspired that age has no limit when you’re passionate about something!
Age is relative. I’ve often said that I want to be the youngest “old” person I know. No limits!
Indeed, Helen. As long as our minds are still functioning, that is! Some days I wonder about mine.
Dianne- I had never seen that video of Joni singing Sisotowbell Lane. Thanks so much for sharing it!
It’s a little fuzzy but fun, eh?
I find the question of voice so interesting. I started blogging in my early 50s, and when I go to blogging conferences I see that I’m definitely in the minority age-wise. While I don’t think blogging (or any other form of creative expression) is necessarily a younger person’s game, I admit that in the early days I struggled with the issue of putting my age out there. Some of that was a lack of confidence as a new blogger and some of it was due to having seen ageism in the workplace. I thought about adopting a persona as my voice, as I’ve seen others do, but I’m glad I made the decision years ago to discover and use my own voice in writing. I have the confidence now to write as myself, not hiding the fact that I’m 59. I see people my age sounding like they’re in the 30s when they write, but not everyone pulls that off. For some it’s natural, but with others it feels forced.
It’s lovely to hear of someone finding success at my stage of life by being herself on the written page. I’m looking forward to reading Kate’s book and learning what she has to teach me about being myself in my writing. And about making pie, of course.
At an IACP Conference in Los Angeles several years ago I took part in a night owl session entitled “Does Age Matter?” Both younger and older folks attended and a lively discussion ensued. There is much to learn and share on both ends of the spectrum.
I hope you enjoy the book Marlene!
It is a long learning curve, especially when reading a nice turn of phrase and wanting to use some of it, only to discover that it doesn’t sound like you. But that is one of the benefits of aging! We know who we are now and how to sound like us.
And of course, the pies in Kate’s books are incredible. And PS I seem to be the oldest person at blogging conferences as well. It just comes with the territory.
Love this and love Kate. She is so generous with her advice and wisdom…glad to see someone giving good and receiving good back! Plus who doesn’t love pie? Maybe crazy people…
Rachel- I once had a neighbor who did NOT like pie! Turned out they weren’t great neighbors either. Not sure if there is a connection but, you never know. 😉
Indeed! I could have done a whole second post about how fabulous the pies are and a third about the beautiful photography, but as a writer, I was struck most by how her voice and personality come through. And how different it is from other cookbooks in that way.
So inspiring. I’ve just turned 70 and just begun to write. I’ve always wanted too, but never had the courage. No time for regrets. Pass the pie!
If I can do it, you can too, Dianne!
Thanks for the interview. I loved this piece and am always looking for tips on how to discover my own deep story and voice. But for now, I have to run out and get the book so that I can make a pie!
Yes I was remiss in saing how wonderful the book is as a cookbook! Thanks for reading, Paula.
This was such a moving and insightful interview. Thank you Kate for sharing the art of non-perfectionism and Dianne for your mindful and kind probing.
Thanks for saying so Hadassah. The art of non-perfection is something many food bloggers should practice! I was pleased to give Kate a platform.
I adore you, Kate. Such a joy to read this and I am beyond thrilled for you success.
Nice, Ashley. Thanks for the comment.